To be fair, Sweet Digs in its current form is innocuous enough. It didn’t begin that way, but that’s where it has landed.
And, to be fair, my mini-eruption this morning had nothing to do with Sweet Digs but everything to do with the role Redfin has assumed of industry hate monger. Take the Forums.
I made reference to a comment posted on the Redfin Forums in which the writer referred to traditional agents as conniving and greedy con artists. I had seen this remark a week ago and the words had been on a slow boil in my brain since. Redfin the Real Estate Company didn’t pen these words, but in effect they did. Their rhetoric from inception has been carefully crafted to incite riot. When I go to an appointment with a buyer or seller, I go intent on demonstrating how I bring more value than my competitors. What I do not do is attempt to elevate my position in their minds by criticizing and demeaning others whom they may be considering.
And, now we have gotten to the bottom of my recent attack on their little locally focused blog, and my sudden unease with even talking about this Redfin stuff at all. I listened to Glenn himself say recently that you should never promote yourself; let others do it, and it becomes viral. Is cancer a virus? By just “putting it out there”, I am giving their business model and their business practices (which I find offensive on many levels) increased exposure and credibility. By lambasting that with which I am in disagreement, I do them one better. I set myself up to be portrayed as that agent living in fear of their “new and better way”, the personification of the old industry guard which has become their poster child for all that is evil in the world.
Traditional agents hate us, traditional agents fear us, traditional agents are pond scum – These are the battle cries of a Redfin trying to get noticed. While they are so obviously wrong on each count, every Redfin rant I post will suggest otherwise to the Redfin target-audience which is being led to feel victimized by an industry (of which Redfin is ironically a part).
Glenn Kelman has professed to having a target market of “geeks with nice houses”, but actions suggest otherwise. If this were entirely true, wouldn’t Redfin be focusing more on the topic of technological innovation and less on declaring an industry and the professionals which are a part to be “messed up”? You can promote the do-it-yourself approach without promoting disparaging, playground-style mudslinging. What is missing from their business plan is respect: Respect for your customers and respect for the other service providers with whom to wish to share the stage.
So, back to the forums comment. “When are the big boys going to get a clue?” has been live since July. Redfin may not have written it, but they have let it stand. Redfin employees routinely post comments, yet their silence in this instance was a tacit “high five”, and this is what I find most objectionable. It’s a crummy way to do business, and I don’t want to fall into the trap of being a pawn in their “viral” approach to destroying the credibility of the millions of hard-working, traditional agents who take their job, their ethics and the satisfaction of their clients very, very seriously.
Until further notice, I am on Redfin hiatus.
John L. Wake says:
“I am on Redfin hiatus.”
Thanks goodness! At last!
August 9, 2007 — 12:43 pm
Glenn Kelman says:
Kris,
I don’t think you are afraid of Redfin, or that you hate Redfin.
I am sorry that a post in Redfin Forums was disrespectful. On our website, we talk about our service and our customers. In our public appearances and in private, we have spoken respectfully of agents. We do not seek to make and then disavow irresponsible statements.
I have never characterized traditional agents as greedy or conniving, have never spoken of traditional agents with contempt (I was upset when my own yard sign was chopped down, but that was at one person, not all agents), and will not tolerate any Redfin employee who does. If you find an instance of our doing this, either in the heat of battle or as a calculated statement, we will reprimand the employee and apologize.
That said, we hope to avoid suppressing comments from users who are critical of traditional brokerages, just as we do not suppress users who are critical of Redfin. On our blog and in our forums, we have allowed to stand many disparaging comments about Redfin and its site.
But there is a difference between a personal attack and calls for reform. The industry is, in our opinion, in need of reform. This isn’t a vague rhetorical claim; we have been very consistent and very specific about the ways we believe the industry needs to reform.
The stake we all have in reform is that some real estate rules damage all of our clients. If we don’t address the need for reform, our industry will have a crisis of credibility among the general public that is far beyond the ability of Redfin to foment.
Redfin’s stake in this reform is the tendency of brokerages to work together against companies like Redfin, a legitimate phenomenon that we may have exacerbated by drawing attention to it in the first place. In the end, after we had tried to resolve issues broker to broker, we felt we had no choice but to speak out.
It is too early to say whether this was a mistake. But we haven’t cried wolf. Does anyone actually doubt that, from the get-go, some brokerages have refused to show our listings, defaced or stolen signs, told clients our business was illegal or promised to block their offers?
You give us too much credit if you believe we had a plan to exploit anti-Realtor consumer sentiment, and probably under-estimate how surprised we were — I have never been hated, and can’t get used to being hated — by the reception we got from the traditional industry in Seattle when we launched Redfin Direct.
We sometimes responded in immature ways, and made intemperate comments — in particular I regret a quote in the LA Times that came out differently than I had intended, for which I have publicly apologized — but we do not have a diabolical plan, nor a deep-seated dislike of traditional agents, least of all of you. Sometimes we just reacted the way a small business would when threatened, out of fear.
And now there are people like Greg who will always hate us, no matter what we do. Or maybe not. Perhaps you will accuse me of being two-faced in arguing that we can have strong opinions about the industry, and still speak to one another respectfully, but I think we can.
August 9, 2007 — 1:41 pm
Michael Fisher says:
Several years ago I read Bubble Blogs daily to get a feel for contrary thinking. I would post comments refuting what was being said with true facts only to get the wrath of the 8-12 loyal blog followers and others who hate real estate agents.
A real estate “expert” and staff writer in our local bird cage liner, ah I mean newspaper, had an article about how bubble head’s were right and NAR and the like were the ones promoting only lies. I responded with a letter to the editor, discounting these blogs as out of our market and out of touch with reality since all bubble predictions since 2002 had been just plain wrong. On the bloglink from his newspaper’s website I was ridiculed and laughed at by all the tin hat wearers, bitter renters and slackers still living virtual lives in their mom’s spare bedroom. One of the bubble heads Goggled me and posted a link to my website saying I was “hiding” the fact that I had a vested interest in continuing the NAR’s alleged lies. While it made my website’s hits go up geometrically it also invited nut cases to send me threats and oddly enough sex act suggestions. It was then that I decided to stop trying to convert bubble heads and others that hate real estate agents since it seemed easier to get a rock to move by looking at it.
Since my hiatus two blogs have stopped postings altogether and the newspaper announced the layoff of 50 people. Giving them any attention is equivalent to giving them credence. It is best to enjoy what we do with people who admire and respect the hard work we do on their behalf. Bubble blogs, Redfin and the like will do fine without our RSS feeds, web hits and comments.
The free market system will in turn take care of them and those served by them. Keep your eye on the snake, know what it’s doing and where it is as you pass, but don’t poke at it on the way by.
August 9, 2007 — 1:49 pm
Jeff Kempe says:
Good grief, Glenn, quit playing the victim; that’s unattractive, untrue and seriously unprofessional.
My sense is no one here hates you; I certainly don’t.
It’s just that you’re a phony. A well practiced, likable and earnest phony, but a phony nonetheless.
To your claim of “I have never characterized traditional agents as greedy or conniving, have never spoken of traditional agents with contempt …” — and pretty much everything else you wrote — I went back and looked again at the Sixty Minutes piece. (http://www.cbsnews.com/sections/i_video/main500251.shtml?id=2796105n)
After Leslie Stahl had set the stage by demonizing traditional agents and our ‘sacrosanct 6% commission…’, you open with a derisive “By far, real estate is the most screwed up industry in America”, notable not just for what, but how it was said. After claiming the savior turf — ‘We can do for real estate what Amazon, Yahoo and eBay have done for other industries…’ you claimed your agents could charge less because they don’t have to ‘spend time in the back of a Lexus with other agents’, relying on a smirk and a symbol to fit the bubblehead stereotype.
The fact is most everyone here thrives on new technology and relishes serious competition; it makes us better at what we do. I have no truck for the Oregon statute that forbids the sharing of commission, and would vote in a second to have it stricken. No one here to my knowledge fears Redfin — that’s your meme, not ours — it’s simply not a model that will work.
What we do have, though, is a serious disregard for a company so void of substance that it seeks to elevate itself by bringing down others. That’s what Kris said so eloquently, and what needs to continue to be said.
(Kris??)
All the best.
August 9, 2007 — 4:15 pm
Kris Berg says:
(On hiatus)
August 9, 2007 — 4:25 pm
Sock Puppet says:
What you resist, persists.
-Athol
August 9, 2007 — 6:14 pm
Phil Hoover says:
Glen ~
At Inman, you joked about how your staff didn’t even know how to handle someone who walked into your office, wanting to buy a home.
Wow ~ what a concept: You can only buy a home through Redfin if you log in and don’t need to talk to a real human being who knows something?
Your business model is based upon minimal service while putting the burden and legal liability upon listing agents.
Offering impersonal, computerized buyer services isn’t a viable business model.
I came away from Inman feeling that you were a genuine, articulate, likable, nice guy with a flawed business model that only appeals to “geeks with nice homes”.
Just how many of those are there, Glenn?
And, how many of them will do business with Redfin?
Probably not enough for Redfin to survive when the VC’s finally stop funding you.
I am all for reforming real estate and believe the profession (we are NOT an industry!) faces massive change in the coming years.
But, I don’t think your business model is going to lead the way to the promised land while you disparage those of us who endeavor to provide exceptional service to our clients.
I urge you to JOIN us in providing exceptional service to our clients instead of mocking, ridiculing, and disparaging us.
Geez, I don’t even OWN a Lexus!
August 10, 2007 — 8:07 am